this post was submitted on 04 Oct 2025
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[–] hcf@sh.itjust.works 136 points 2 weeks ago (51 children)

For those of you doubting the claims for lack of evidence, stating that you'll "wait for the facts" or evidence before allowing yourslf to be outraged—

Where is your outrage for the countless other people who were there who personally testified to being beaten, abused, and paraded around like trophies?

There are already multiple interviews with Chris Smalls, a black American labor organizer, who directly confirmed that he had been beaten, choked, packed like a sardine into a small cell, sleep deprived, strip searched, and completely brutalized by the Israeli navy and prison system.

Ask yourself—why does this need to have happened to the appropriately aged, white, European female on a 4k, live streamed or recorded feed with corroborating testimony by the Israelis and the national newspapers of the country of origin of the supposed victim—why is that the bar you've set for credulity?

What does that say about you or your reaction to the situation?

Wake. Up.

Fuck the details, fuck the squabbling over what constitutes "roughness" versus physical assault. Fuck the inclination to want to hear "the other side" of the story. Things are going horribly wrong in Israel/Palestine—in a place that we've all been told over and over is supposed to be demonstrably above reproach. If even half these claims are true—if even a single one of them is true—what GOOD is it preserving the supposed beacon of democracy in the middle east when they treat foreigners this way?

Even if you think these activists are mentally unwell, or menaces, or being performative, or just doing this for "selfies"—so what? We all know these activists are obviously not terrorists and at least some of them genuinely believe what they are doing. None of this justifies their treatment. Nothing justifies the richest and proudest countries on earth—however much you might agree with that claim—what GOOD is that if our prisons condemn people to absolute squalor and abandonment to the whims of their guards?

HOW is this any different from the indignity camps? These peoples possessions were seized as trophies , their clothes taken, their bodies crammed together like chattel. Do there need to be ovens for there to be discernable lines? Must you feel the radiant heat on your own brows before you'll indulge the sensation that something isn't right here?

Wake. Up.

[–] RaivoKulli@sopuli.xyz 36 points 2 weeks ago (34 children)

Waiting for the facts is a pretty sensible move in most situations.

[–] TheDannysaur@lemmy.world 11 points 2 weeks ago

I'm never going to say don't wait for facts.

But the issue is that "the facts" can take years to assertain... Sometimes there's a lot of damage that can be done.

It's a delicate balance. People weaponize "wait for the facts" to just delay and dull the impact. Like most things, it's not black and white.

I don't think saying "most" is the best application here.

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