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I'm looking for a folding bike and the two I'm considering most closely are the Tern Verge D9 and the Link D8.
I like that the Verge D9 has disc brakes and I have a strange attraction to its 451 wheels.
The Link D8 has a wider variety of compatibile tires but I don't prefer V-brakes.
Do you know a strong reason to choose one over the other? A strong reason I should be looking at something else entirely?
These are kind of apples and oranges. The Tern Link line is more of a last-mile, multimodal commuter bike and are a "value" segment. The Verge line are more of a fast urban bike. For example, Tern used to make a drop bar Verge that had a very high level of components.
As @Diplomjodler mentioned, hard pass on v-brakes. There used to be amazing v-brakes brakes, but it's a technology that has been eclipsed by disc brakes. Now, v-brakes brakes on a new bike are the hallmark of cheapness. There are still good aftermarket v-brakes brakes out there, but it's going to be money better spent on better starting technology.
I've owned a bunch of Terns, and my partner works in a shop that sells Tern. The Verge bikes are mostly good to really great. The Link bikes are mostly okay to "OMFG, this was made by Tern?!"
Got it and fully agree on the state of V-brakes. I used a pair of XTs on a cyclocross frame until a few years, with compressionless housing and all that and they were brilliant, apart from the modulation.
Funnily I'm looking at the D9 specifically instead of the higher end models, because it comes with a steel fork, which isn't subject to fatigue cracks. Forks tend to bend a lot when braking, which happens often, and I'm afraid might accelerate the ageing of the aluminum.
Any other recommendations for folders, or thoughts?
I have a few bikes with aluminum and CF forks. One of my main whips was all aluminum and I sold that bike at ~125,000 miles and had no worries about it going another 125,000. I did everything with that bike: loaded touring, mixed surfaces, commuting, rutted/rooty trails, hucking down stairs... With the much lower moment arm of the 406 and 451 wheels, I'd have absolutely zero fork concerns. FWIW, my mountain bike is full rigid with an aluminum fork, 29" wheels, 203mm front rotor (for which it's not designed), and I beat the snot out of that bike. Still going strong with all my crashes, abuse, air time, and generally misguided actions. Between the 29er wheel and the larger rotor, that's a looooong moment arm reefing on the fork in multiple axes.
And Terns are quite bulletproof, almost literally. I had an S27h that, among other indignities*, got caught by a loose tarp in a windstorm. Spokes broke, a pedal cracked, fenders ripped off, handlebars bent, rear rack snapped, and a huge ditch carved in the yard where it was thrashing. I repaired the damage and rode that bike another ~5000 miles. The frame and fork were just fine, just a few scratches. There weren't even any dents. I gave that bike to a friend a five years ago, and it's his daily driver to this day.
*It fell in the ocean a week after I bought it. Because I'm an idiot.
For folders, it really depends on your use case, budget, and fit. I'm also a huge fan of Bike Fridays, and owned four over the years: a Pocket Rocket (the 451 wheel speed demon), Speeding Tikit, and two NWT Silks. I think Tern is the better value proposition, but Fridays tend to have a better feeling ride. Bike Friday's motto used to be "As good as your best bike." And my Pocket Rocket absolutely went toe-to-toe with my Cannondale R2000. In some ways, the Friday was better because it was more comfortable and accelerated like a shot from a gun.
Bromptons are amazing, but just not my jam for a wide variety of reasons that probably only apply to me. :D
If you don't really need the folding, check out mini-velos, such as the Velo Orange Neutrino.
There are other niche brands, such as Birdy or Moulton, but I don't have direct experience with anything not listed above.
*It fell in the ocean a week after I bought it. Because I’m an idiot.
😆
Thanks for the musings!
I looked at Bike Friday and they look really nice for travelling, fold-travel-unfold-ride. They only one that looks appropriate for frequent folding on the train during daily commute seems to be the pakIT. I'd definitely go for that instead of a Brompton for a 16" bike in that price range. Seems like they don't make the Tikit anymore. It looks like the best commuter folder they've had.
I'm just having flashbacks to about 20 years ago, when i tried to put XT V-brakes on my mountain bike. Those fuckers were screeching like a horde of angry banshees and I never managed to get them to be quiet. Disc brakes are such a huge step forward.
Probably was just your rim / brake pad mix. I remember had a screeching bike like this too when i was young, but on my current bike with v brakes it does not screech.
If i would buy new, i probably would want to go for disc brakes, not that there'd be much other choice, haha. But i feel people have a warped view on v-brakes, i have no real complaints. Super simple mechanics. Big alpine passes, loaded bike, in the rain.. the stuff that people tell you is impossible is in my lived reality no problem at all. And holy shit do brake pads last a long time on those. I still like v-brakes, certainly not something that makes me want to buy a new bike.
I tried at least three different pads.
Hm, yeah was just a guess. I could not live with screeching brakes either, the horror of riding a screeching loaded bike down a high alpine pass 😁
I slapped on some Avid V-brakes and never had an issue again.
My XT is quiet with original pads on a Mavic rim, currently operating at the rear of another bike, but I think Rim Wrangler (Avid) is better. Those pads have always been fire no matter the brake or rim.
As for disc, ironically the metal pads from Shimano are silent for me while the mixed/resin howled.
I hadn't used V-brakes in at least 15 years so that's a moot point.
I can't speak for the Verge, but I've had a D8 for well over 5000km, and have done some long (150km+ rides on it).
The v-brakes are excellent on a bike like this, and far less of a pain in the ass compared to disc brakes (lighter, too).
The stock D8 is more utilitarian with the included fenders and rear rack. This does add weight to it, despite being lighter than the Verge D9.
If you're looking for something to get from point A to B with no plans to ride in rain or haul things, the Verge seems like a solid option.
What's the country of origin on it?
Made in Vietnam 🇻🇳
Build quality to your opinion?
Excellent, but I haven't really had any experience with other folding bikes, either.
The stock Schwalbe Big Apple tires are great. The rims, even after over 5,000 km, are still in perfect condition, and I use kool stop salmon pads. I did put a suspension seatpost for added comfort, and I recently changed the shifter to an older style friction shifter, since it's my preference. And I also upgraded the cassette recently to a 34 tooth, which slightly benefits climbing ability.
I added a front rack as well as the luggage truss which allows you to attach all kinds of different basket and bag options.
It's absolutely a head turner, and I get asked about it all the time, pretty much every time I take it out. People ask if it's electric, and they want to know more about the folding bike and whatnot. It's awesome.
But when compared to my road bike, or even my 90's mountain bike, it is the slowest of the three. Which may not be a big deal for some, but it should be noted.
Excuse me but.. how did you put a suspension post on that? The pics show a single continuous, long seat post. The suspension posts I'm aware of aren't that long. Did you do some tube-in-a-tube expletive?
Thanks for all the info!
Great question. It's fairly easy, but needs an extra component.
Tern has a product called the telescopic seatpost, which allows you to use more conventional 27.2 mm seatposts, since the telescopic post is in two parts (the lower half goes into the bike's frame).
Then I got the Suntour SP12 NCX, and replaced the top half of the telescopic seatpost with that.
Installed and saddle, and that's it.
It really helps to smooth out jolts, and find it much more comfortable when riding on a bike with smaller tires.
🤗
Beautiful, so they sell you the pipe to put the other pipe in. Nice. 😄 And yeah, I ride suspension post too. Kinekt in my case.
Awesome! They make a nice suspension stem, too.
Is the Suntour damped or just a spring?
It uses an internal (adjustable) spring, and the design allows the saddle to pivot back, rather than up and down. This keeps your leg length to the cranks the same throughout the motion.
It's very comfortable, and almost no maintenance (you lube the spring every once in a while).
When I got it, it was just over $100, which was way cheaper than any of the other high end suspension posts. I think it's gone up at least $50 since then, but that's still a good value. LOL
I would never buy a bike with V-brakes any more. That alone would be a deciding factor for me.
I own a Tern Verge D9. It's a functional and sporty folder.
The Verge is a snappy feeling ride. Think road-bike handing. The tires are also good, but at 30mm it won't like anything rougher than hard-pack dirt. They're also ISO 451, not the more common 406. This size has fewer tires to choose from for a slightly nicer roll. It's up to you to not if that's a worthy hassle.
FYI, the magnetic latch is terrible. You will have chipped paint on the fork. I don't mind but you may.
Careful folding and unfolding. The stem fold likes to bite the brake and shifting lines. That will screw up shifting.
The matching rack they sell uses oversized tubes. You may need to replace the hooks on existing panniers. Also the racks sits closely to the pedals, so large things may have some foot overlap.
I'm sure I have other thoughts floating around about the Verge D9. Ask anything you'd like to know about it and I'll try answering.
Thanks for the info! The current model seems to come with 38c tires. I saw there's very little variety in the 451 diameter and most are 28c. I'm thinking that if I end up needing wider tires and there's nothing available, I could replace the wheelset with 406. Since it's using disc brakes that should work fine. I was considering converting the front of a Link D8 to disc but it seems like 20" disc forks are much harder to find than 406 disc wheels. Have you looked into a front rack? Is it Taiwan-made or PRC-made? Have you fit fenders on it? Can it roll folded without the special rack for rolling?
The 38 tires should really help on the rougher paths. Maybe I'll pick them up when I wear out my current set.
I haven't tried the front rack yet. Not out of dislike but because I usually pack nothing or way too much. 🤣
Same goes with fenders. I haven't installed them, and probably won't. It's too sunny where I'm from.
The frame is made in Vietnam. The quality is alright, not amazing but certainly appropriate for the price point. No issues with it so far and better than some frames I've seen from the PRC.
It can roll without a rolling rack, but not easily. Good enough for a few feet here and there. I suggest going for the rolling rack if you want to push it around train platforms and such. The saddle is padded on the underside though. It's nice when going up stairs.
One more thing: the drive train is exposed when folded. Watch out for dirty chains and be careful when loading it into a car. It's easy to damage the derailleur hanger or disk brake if it tips over. Support the bike with a box or tie it down when transporting it.
A note on tires, turns out there's another compatible "standard" for 451. It's called OS20. From what I gather it's 451 but with wider widths. There are a few models. I saw some Tioga, Kenda.
That's great to know. I'll keep that in mind when I need a new set of tires.