That's not necessarily a direct correlary. The Nazis called themselves socialists. They weren't. Antifa seem anti fascist, but it's not because of how they choose to name themselves.

Although as a non centralized non organized organisation, is it what they call themselves or just a useful tool to oppress people with accusation?

[–] 0ops@piefed.zip 13 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Don't overthink it, anti-fascist is a stance. You don't want fascism? You're anti-fascist! Welcome to Antifa

[–] hitmyspot@aussie.zone -2 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Yes, it is. If you ask most people, it just in America, but worldwide, of they are ant fascist, they will likely say yes. Ask if they are antifa, they will likely say no. It's not the same thing and words can be misused.

[–] 0ops@piefed.zip 1 points 1 month ago (1 children)

The only time "Antifa" doesn't mean "anti-fascist" one-to-one is when a fascist is using it as a boogie-man. Anyone who doesn't equate the two has fallen for their propaganda campaign

[–] hitmyspot@aussie.zone 2 points 1 month ago

Yes, I agree. However, that is not because of the name, in and if itself. And the fact that the right has made the name a boogieman is relevant.

Which is why my point to the original poster was that just by virtue of calling themselves antifa does not make them anti fascist. Look at actions not words or propaganda, from either side of politics or from fascists or those opposed to fascism.

[–] Cethin@lemmy.zip 6 points 1 month ago (2 children)

You're being downvoted to hell, but you're right. A name alone doesn't mean shit. Republicans don't care about the republic, for example. They want a dictatorship.

I will say, everything I know about Antifa is legitimately anti-fascist. The name happens to correlate with the reality in this case.

[–] hitmyspot@aussie.zone 1 points 1 month ago

Yes, for the most part. However there are different meanings to different people. Some mean antifa to mean being generally opposed to fascism . Others take it to mean being politically active to disrupt fascism. Others on the right use it as a made up term for a non existent terrorist group, as a means to undermine actual efforts to disrupt fascism and exert control.

If you ask most people are they against fascism and they say yes. Ask if they are a member of antifa and they say no.

[–] 0ops@piefed.zip 1 points 1 month ago (1 children)

I will say, everything I know about Antifa is legitimately anti-fascist.

Antifa is literally short for anti-fascist. It's a slang. Antifa is not an organization or even a movement per se, it's just a hip word for the ideological stance "fuck fascism". So it says a lot when a politician proclaims that they're antiantifa

[–] Cethin@lemmy.zip 2 points 1 month ago (1 children)

It's not just slang. There are and have been actual groups that use the term to define themselves. Yeah, it's also sometimes just a term to define intent, but it hasn't always just been that.

My point is, just taking someone's word for something is risky. Many groups have used terms "incorrectly" to deceive others. Yeah, antifi, in all the iterations I know of, does not have this issue, but it doesn't change the fact that the name alone is not enough to know intention.

[–] 0ops@piefed.zip 0 points 1 month ago (1 children)

That the word can be misused seems beside the point, no? A liar can call themselves "anti-fascist" just as easily as they can call themselves "antifa". That doesn't change the meaning of the word though, it just makes them a liar.

[–] Cethin@lemmy.zip 2 points 1 month ago

It's not beside the point. It's literally the point the comment above was making. Yes, it makes them a liar. That's what this chain has been saying. Them being a liar doesn't change the fact they're calling themselves that. Again, Nazis called themselves socialist. Going after them doesn't mean you're against socialism.

[–] Archangel1313@lemmy.ca 5 points 1 month ago (1 children)

I'm pretty sure the name is just a literal description of their political views, regarding fascism.

[–] hitmyspot@aussie.zone 1 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Yes, in their case it is. However, it's not always the case and that's my point. Names can be deceptive and can be misused. Look at actions, not words.

A rose by any other name can still stink when rotten.

[–] Rothe@piefed.social 5 points 1 month ago (1 children)

What are you on about? Antifa is just short for anti-fascist. If you are anti-fascist you are antifa whether you like it or not. It is not deeper than that.

[–] hitmyspot@aussie.zone 3 points 1 month ago

Antifa and anti fascist are not always the same thing. However for the most part I agree.

My point was that the original poster said by virtue of calling themselves anti fascist, that makes it so. That's not the case.

Just like Nazis calling themselves socialists isn't accurate nor the current American right calling themselves Christian.

Political groups use words for power and to direct thoughts. We should look at actions, but we should be wary of any argument that rests exclusively on what someone calls themselves. It's circular logic.

[–] Septimaeus@infosec.pub 7 points 1 month ago

If antifa is an actual political organization, militia, or whatever they’ve been described as by the far right for over a decade, how on earth do I still have no idea where to donate?

[–] ysjet@lemmy.world 5 points 1 month ago

Is it just me or did the picture get deleted?

[–] saltesc@lemmy.world 5 points 1 month ago (2 children)

What terror?

[–] curbstickle@anarchist.nexus 22 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Hell - what groups.

Antifascism is not some structured military-esque organization with membership rolls, such as, I don't know, AWD, Aryan Nations, America First Committee, Vanguard, Werewolf 88, Patriot Front, Sons of Liberty, Stormfront, American Front, Hammerskins, 8 bajillion 3 Percenters groups, Frontiersmen, Oath Keepers, etc, etc, etc.

Fuck there are so many hate groups out there.

Usually people don't organize into weird militia groups for "Don't be shitty to other people!" unless lots of people are being shitty to other people, so... You know...

[–] No_Ones_Slick_Like_Gaston@lemmy.world 3 points 1 month ago

Keep telling people this after the Seattle riots, where do I sign and how. An I be a member, and obviously is not an organization with membership and rituals like the Klan that 🍊🌮 supports with J6rs and the "Proud Bois"

[–] jonne@infosec.pub 10 points 1 month ago

You know, when one of Nick Fuentes' groyper fans kills someone, it's somehow antifa's fault.

[–] TigerAce@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 1 month ago

Anti fascists are labeled terrorists? When was the last time that happened? Oh wait, I remember, during nazi Germany.

[–] scathliath@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 1 month ago

Just saying, but didn't they already do that? Pretty sure Biden declared Antifa terrorists already, does that make Antifa like, terrorist squared? Or just not terrorists again?