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I can honestly say I have thoroughly enjoyed my time as a federal worker.
Right now I'm working on my resume. I'm open to work, preferably in finance as I have my accounting degree. If you know of anyone hiring please let me know.
As I have mentioned before, please do not post your political beliefs as I am not interested in debates or opinions. During this time, please remember that government employees are workers at risk of losing their job. It's scary as most of us have dedicated our careers to government and government operations is all that most of us know and now will be forced to look outside for other options and start over. No matter which side everyone is one, no one wants to lose their job so please be mindful of this. Remember that government employees are humans too and it is a very scary time for most of us and our families.
do you wanna stop fascism? want to see trump and elon musk lose power?
working class solidarity is the first step
our entire lives, we've been tricked and manipulated into fighting among ourselves, because they know if we worked together, we would be able to take them down.
why do you think, every time that something bad happens, there's all the media spin about who we should blame?
they love to do this for age, think about all the boomers vs. gen X vs. gen Z articles and social media posts you've seen
but they do the same shit all the time with different things. their aim is to split the working class into as many splinter groups as possible.
we need to stop letting the assholes in power divide us like this.
unfortunately, that means extending solidarity to people who haven't earned it, including people who chose to vote for Trump.
most of these people were tricked and manipulated. many of them have been fed a steady diet of misinformation. many of them are proud, insufferable bigots.
but being smugly superior, insulting, rude or intolerant isn't how we change people's minds. the best way to do that is by having a two-way conversation.
we are all so busy yelling at eachother. it doesn't work. we need solidarity.
No, it does not mean extending solidarity to people who are ok with hurting everyone but themselves, they can go and fuck right off. So whatever solidarity you have in your mind, I for one won't be a part of that
yeah. it's not bad to help them incidentally-as a byproduct of helping everyone, but helping them specifically, even by extending a momentary gesture of compassion, is a moral failing.
i totally get what you mean, and of course i would never ever push anyone into it. i just read some kinda dark comments in this thread and i wished that people would be a little more compassionate
i know they don't deserve it, really - and i totally get how you can think of it as "aiding the enemy" or something.
but i genuinely believe that we can reduce harm just by being a bit more compassionate, a bit more patient, and a bit less aggressive
fascists believe that the world is polarized into "us" and "them", and they believe that "them" would stop at nothing to destroy them.
just a simple act of compassion can show them that there are choices beyond destruction
I think once you get past a certain point on fascism, you can no longer adapt to material conditions. you can no longer become not-a-fascist. both because of sunk cost/ego investment/identity, but also because of the way they treat the very concept of facts.
no point in treating them like humans after that. they very much are not. they cannot be healed. they cannot be cured. everything they accuse others of, they are-this only applies to fascists, and things like them. I can call you a chainsaw juggling lizard person, and I will gain no new skills.
edit: yep, just checked. no new skills or scales.
dehumanizing people is the first step on the road to genocide.
if you could click your fingers and everyone who voted Trump died, regardless of how they now feel about it, would you do it?
I gave this some thought.
Yes, I would do that.
Do you know how many problems that would solve middle and long-term? Yes, there would be short-term disruptions... a lot of short-term disruptions.
A huge chunk of the problem billionaires would be gone- literally all of the billionaires who own the major media outlets in the US would be gone. The Republican party would cease to exist instantly. There would be a precipitous drop in the number of the belligerently stupid and easily manipulated.
I did not dehumanize them. they did. I'm pissed about it.
every one? I dunno. I don't value human life very much, so maybe, but im certain a lot of them were just sloppy idiots with zero forethought, I expect not even a majority were to the point they were unrecoverable. every qanon? yes.
So they're not unrecoverable, but we still shouldn't treat them like humans?
you're being disingenuous, read what I said.
I know what you said.
I'm with you other than the part about not treating them like humans.
Bad take.
okay, so, what is a person? why does it matter?
and are there things that aren't human, that we should consider treating to at least some degree like people? hypothetical actual-AI, various large mammals, corvids, cephalopods, hypothetical aliens, superorganisms of whatever kind, etc?
if your answer is "because I want it extended to me" fascists will not do that. treating them like people does not forward your goal. disrespecting them might.
if your answer is about some fundamental capacities you respect, my bet is fascists have less of those than the average dog, and extending them any courtesy you would not extend to a dog should not be extended to fascists. not that you should extend them any of the courtesies you would extend to a dog. they are not good boys.
Really? This is where you want to take it? There's plenty of scholarly discussion about dehumanization (particuarly surrounding WW2 and the events leaading up to it)....
Here is something I found after a quick search (I'm sure there are better examples out there. Hannah Arendt is a good place to start):
https://www.cambridge.org/core/books/abs/anthem-companion-to-hannah-arendt/explaining-genocide-hannah-arendt-and-the-socialscientific-concept-of-dehumanization/9F5785E91D0742BD3429D7B1933156F1
I was going to copy/paste more before realizing I was just copying the entire page. I highly recommend you just read the thing yourself.
Nothing good ever comes from dehumanizing people.
Regarding your argument about other animals... I just... I don't even know what to say. We are talking about humans being viewed as less than human. Has nothing to do with treating animals like people (which is also something we shouldn't do, but for completely unrelated reasons).
okay you're just arguing in bad faith because I said in another thread that your degree was bullshit. cry more, maybe go rape some of your patients or something, whatever you do to chill.
I have no idea who you are or what you're referring to.
The fuck? First of all, what patients? What is it that you think that I do? Second... super classy, dude.
Edit: Oh didn't even realize you were the same person demonizing psychiatry in another thread. Wow you're just a bad take machine.
I'm not a psychiatrist, by the way, I just take issue with people saying ignorant shit about subjects they clearly do not understand. And I find it offensive that you would suggest that psychiatrists are rapists, or that I'm a rapist because (you think) I'm a psychiatrist. What an extremely aggressive and shitty thing to say.
Again, more Scientology shit. If you really aren't part of the Church of Scientology, maybe it's time to look into it because hatred of psychiatry is like the basis of their cult.
I disagree. These are the people who call compassion the "woke mind virus" and they are takers. They live their entire lives taking from others because they think they deserve it. Yet fight against others receiving support and care.
Expend energy on people who give back instead.
thanks for your comment, i completely understand your perspective, but, you know, they say exactly the same kinda stuff about the people that they hate. it makes me uncomfortable seeing MAGA reflected in their enemies
something something gaze into the abyss something
I don't care what they say because they're liars. That's the difference. There's objectively no value in meeting liars half way. There's no value in "hearing them out" and there's no value in acting as though we just need to empathize harder.
They don't care if they lie as long as it furthers their goal, they don't care to hear what anyone else thinks, and they don't have any interest in empathy. If any of my prior statements were false then we wouldn't be where we are.
Your attempt to normalize Nazis is fucked up, to be honest. I am not a hateful person, I am done giving hateful people comfort. You should be ashamed for trying to equate the two concepts.
maybe you could approach me with compassion and try to understand, instead of just riding in on a high horse to pass judgment
or don't, believe what you want. i know i'm right.
doing the right thing is often hard. i'm gonna keep punching nazis, but when i see trump voters having their lives ruined, i'm going to put hatred aside to try to create a better world. you may not agree with me, but i hope my comments moved at least a few people.
We are tired of the hate. The tribalism. At the end of the day us seeing their humanity might help them see ours. We’ve been doing the hate for the past 8 years and it’s gotten us here.
Empathy will get more converts while anger will further radicalize all of us
i totally get that, i really do. and if you don't think it's right for you, i fully respect that choice, and besides, some of us still need to be the "stick" so that the "carrot" gets put into perspective!
thanks for your reply! <3
Well, we have our differences, but - kudos to you for trying to make people more open and compassionate. It really matters
There is a reason every time FOX News brings Bernie Sanders in to debate socialism or some such tripe, he ends up converting the entire panel to his ideas and it turns into the hosts asking him questions about things they weren't even aware of in terms of class divide.
Seriously, this is LITERALLY THE REASON WHY THEY ARE TRYING TO DIVIDE US WITH RACE. If we don't realize that the very same deluded idiots who believe these lies are also our best bet for kicking the assholes out of government, we're JUST as bad as they are. Yes, they are doing atrocious things and they are reprehensible.
But even if a magic genie appeared and gave us a new, amazing, socialist president who wanted to bring our country to the 24th century and beyond, we would STILL have to live next to the millions and millions of dumbfounded fools who will always believe the simpler story. Education may help, but not for generations. We have to work with the hand we've been dealt.
Start spreading the story that it's rich versus poor, that it's wealthy elites crushing us all, left or right, that we're all being fooled and played against each other. Read up on economic distribution in the US and listen to some of Bernie's speeches and take fucking notes. We CAN change this, but we have to make a better story for the morons to follow.
You cannot extend solidarity to people unwilling to recognize or engage with it. It's the ratchet effect/overton window. We stand up for their rights, they don't stand up when we exercise those same rights. Medication gets more expensive? Everyone is incensed. Viagra is taken off the expensive list, but HIV/birth control meds stay on it, where'd the outcry go? VA benefits slashed? Huge mobilization. Benefits for women's shelters slashed? Crickets from them. We end up in a situation where only white men have rights because that's the only time we're all standing together. Until I see more white men fighting for women and minorities, I'm gonna have to ask why you think this strategy is working. (Obviously, #notAllMen or whatever)
hell yeah, great message, thanks for writing it up!
you should copy and paste it somewhere else so more people see it
I like you. You're a nice person.
thank you! i try my best, but i don't always succeed!
In my real life I'm much more sympathetic. Even to the point of empathy exhaustion. But when it's strangers online exponentially far away from me on the Dunbar scale, I laugh, ridicule and taunt.
This is my relief. Same way I'll text a buddy and shit on him when his team is getting crushed in a game.
Empathy and class warfare are locked in a timeless battle anymore, but I think there's still room to point at fucking idiots and enjoy their suffering. After all, they'd do the same for us.
i totally get that! we can't all be perfect all the time, and i totally get that for some people they've just been hurt too much to ever have a shred of kindness or sympathy towards the people who are at least partially responsible for that pain
i just wish that people could be a bit less hateful, at least. reading the comments in this thread is honestly quite scary. i don't like seeing just... pure hate, from people i would like to be allies with. it reminds me of the hate right-wingers have tbh
I think we've been pressure cooked as a country (speaking as an American as that's my only real, long term reference) and maybe a society thanks to social media to amplify thay hate and outrage.
If its any small consolation, I think the communities around here are hurt and frustrated and learning how to express thay and navigate it in a space where immediate censorship isn't as likely too occur.
Its a lot like the way we used to stretch our legs and push boundaries in the early Internet days. It wasn't easy to get mod banned on most irc servers, but it did happen. In between those moments though, you could get away with saying some vile stuff.
Don't take it to heart, take it as a vent in a place where we are somewhat protected from the hate speech the other side slings.
but honestly, it's not a safe space, i've seen anti-trump people be really homophobic, sexist, racist...
sometimes it's hard to see that big of a difference between trump supporters and the people who really aggressively hate on trump supporters.
shit, i checked your history to see if you were cool. 'both sides'? really?
Didn't they just say they're not interested in a two way conversation? They want support from the people that they voted against the rights of/wills of, because I assure you, plenty of Rs are thinking their cushy fed job should never have existed, and they have no sympathy.
"Views on the impact of downsizing USAID divide sharply along partisan lines, with most Democrats and independents expecting more illness and death in low-income countries (91% and 69%, respectively), and most Republicans expecting positive impacts on domestic programs (72%) and the budget deficit (67%)."
figure they aren't down to be anarchists, requires too much forethought and consideration, but ask them if they would be cool to join the communists and fight for the rights of all workers. if they aren't down for that, fuck em.
honestly, you never know - anyone can be brainwashed and radicalized, it's not just something that happens to stupid people
i went through a little alt-right phase when i was younger, now i'm an anarchist i want to go back in time and kick my own ass.
people sometimes take strange, winding journeys to get where they're going!
Everyone is the product of their environment, etc.
it's not about brainwashing. I mean, that's in there, but that's not what makes fascists unrecoverable.
it's about the way they consume information. hitler talked about how you should read books; by basically skimming and cherry picking things that support your world view, and discarding the rest of the 'junk'. if all information-all of reality-is consumed that way, you cannot fix them, you cannot heal them, except with a bullet.
there is time between "lol i named my account baskedkekhitler1488" and this, but once they reach that point, and once they have done enough horrible shit that they would have to reconcile with being a good person, they cannot be human again.
people can change their minds about stuff, you know?
not that i really advocate for anyone to engage with someone who willingly accepts the label of fascist or approves of fascist ideology
i was really more aiming towards the people who aren't fascist but got misled by misinformation and propaganda, than outright fascists
see, that's ... well it's a huge problem, but it's not the one I'm talking about. yeah, those are still people. probably. they can still, as a group, generally, do all the important person-stuff that makes 'person' an important category.
I get that, and I try, but keeping down so much bile is taxing. Any advice for that?
first of all, don't put too much pressure on yourself, it's really tough to hold back sometimes. if you can't hold it back, that's okay! sometimes, people do need to be told when they're being cunts sometimes.
but what does help me a bit is really going all-in on the "kill with kindness" thing, really just turning on all the southern charm and hokum. i find playing that character to be quite funny, so it feels less like i'm being taken for a ride, it's more like i have a private joke.
also, i think it really helps to find some common ground, even for some of the worst people imaginable, they'll usually say at least something you agree with, even if it's something silly, like you both like the same video game - i always start with the common ground, people are way more receptive when you open with "yes, i agree with you, and...", that's honestly been really effective for me.
if you look through my history you'll find plenty of evidence of me not taking my own advice. but i'm trying, and i'm trying to bring others with me
i don't think we all need to be perfect, if we can all just try a little bit
I'm in a comment chain with you elsewhere in this post, but I've seen you responding a lot and though I think anyone unwilling to push a "fascists go poof forever" button is part of the problem, it seems like you really believe in positivity and I have to commend you for that. Best of luck with the deradicalization effort. Really hope you're taking care of yourself.
thank you for your thoughtful comment, sometimes it's tough, i wake up to usually 10+ replies telling me i'm wrong and that i'm basically hitler, and a bunch of DMs just throwing hate at me, so nice comments are a nice change of pace!
btw, if it helps, i'd totally press that button if it existed! sadly, it doesn't, and can't exist. fascism isn't something that you're born with, it's an evil that grows inside us. none of us are immune, and probably all of us are dealing with a mild infection.
that's where all the hate and vitriol comes from. that's the dark part of us that enjoys seeing others suffer, and wants to solve our problems with violence, and wants to see everything in black and white.
we've been violently anti-fascist for nearly 100 years now, nazi is literally one of the most insulting things you can be called, and most people would happily look the other way if you punched a nazi. if violence and hate was an effective way of fighting fascism, we wouldn't be in this situation. it's just not effective
one mr. alan dulles might disagree. look up that dude's entire career.
I think we were violently anti-fascist at any scale for about five minutes when the fascists fucked with the bag, and for that we turned the shattered glass in german streets to liquid. then went home and put slightly lower profile fascists right back in charge, poached their best fascists, and used their worst nazi murderhobo bastards to do "anti communism" around the world for the next thirty years while they trained up the next generation. the ones who were put in charge in japan weren't even low profile fascists. emperor stayed emperor, and a guy whose nickname was 'the monster of', who had a full time assistant to mop up the cum from all the rape he did while he ran the official military rape program, ran japan, his family stayed regular providers of prime ministers until some dude popped one with a homemade shotgun-gadget a couple years ago
i know that, i mean among the working class. tolerance for listening to a friend spouting nazi shit and fascist shit has been pretty low until recently, dogwhistles not withstanding. i mean there's a reason they dogwhistle so much, it's because their views are roundly rejected and they get bullied when they don't hide their beliefs
if that level of hate, aggression, suppression, etc. isn't enough to prevent the rise of fascism, it won't be enough to slow or stop it either. we need different tactics
Nah, fuck that. Trump voters are a minority. We don't need them.