this post was submitted on 25 Apr 2025
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Luigi Mangione is accused of stalking United Healthcare CEO Brian Thompson and shooting him to death on Dec. 4, 2024.

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[–] Nougat@fedia.io 186 points 19 hours ago (3 children)

Solidarity aside, whenever you are arraigned, any lawyer worth their salt will advise you to plead not guilty, because entering a guilty plea means it's over, move on to sentencing, where you have no leverage at all.

You can always change a not guilty plea to a guilty plea later, if a plea deal offered by the prosecution is acceptable to you. This is especially relevant in a case where the death penalty is on the table, but also applies to the possibility of reduced charges or penalties in any case.

I'll also add that this case could well end up with an Alford plea. In short, where the defendant asserts innocence, does not admit to the criminal act, but accepts the sentence because they believe that a jury would find them guilty based on the evidence. Again, this is definitely related to a case where the death penalty is on the table.

[–] thanksforallthefish@literature.cafe 127 points 19 hours ago (5 children)

I'd be very disappointed in any jury who found him guilty

[–] jjagaimo@sh.itjust.works 91 points 17 hours ago (3 children)

Having been on a jury,

People are dumb and have no empathy

[–] Palerider@feddit.uk 51 points 16 hours ago

~~Having been on a jury~~

People are dumb and have no empathy

[–] Ledericas@lemm.ee 5 points 10 hours ago* (last edited 10 hours ago)

also heard the smart ones get out of jury duty. i had a former colleague in an old job said she was chosen because she wouldnt speak for herself.

[–] BakerBagel@midwest.social 12 points 14 hours ago

People might not have empathy, but even less people are going to want to side with an insurance company

[–] Charlxmagne@lemmy.world 23 points 15 hours ago (1 children)

Realistically they'll try arrange one that will. They're going to try secure a guilty verdict by any means necessary to make an example out of him.

[–] ZoopZeZoop@lemmy.world 12 points 14 hours ago

That would be the worst thing for them to do, but they're not the brightest.

[–] Nougat@fedia.io 28 points 18 hours ago (4 children)

Ideally, a jury's responsibility is to weigh the evidence and find whether the evidence supports a guilty verdict beyond a reasonable doubt.

There has been no jury selection yet, let alone presentation of evidence. I would guess that any jury nullification would depend on a defense tactic of "Yes, my client committed this act, and his motive was to prevent UHC from directly causing the deaths of their customers by refusing to honor legitimate claims or by delaying payment of claims." There might be something there, especially since UHC changed its stance on something (I forget exactly what right now) in the wake of their CEO being killed.

But that would be a really difficult defense to mount. You'd basically be admitting to the act and hoping that at least one person on the jury would A) agree with your defense, and B) be willing to hold out over it, and C) not be replaced by an alternate for "failure to follow jury instructions" or some such thing.

Again, since a jury has not even been selected, I won't speculate on what evidence gets presented and what evidence (if any) ends up being excluded. By extension, I cannot agree with your above comment.

Please note that I am also not saying "He's guilty, he should hang", because that would also entail speculating on evidence.

[–] Zaktor@sopuli.xyz 16 points 15 hours ago

They don't have to say outright that the guy was scum and got what he deserved, just question why the federal charges are being brought while there's a state case and ask questions about how many other people would have a good reason to want this health insurance executive dead. You can introduce the message without abandoning all other defense and saying it explicitly.

[–] Alaik@lemmy.zip 11 points 14 hours ago

"The man who saves his country breaks no laws" isn't that right DoJ?

[–] militaryintelligence@lemmy.world 6 points 14 hours ago (1 children)

They'll find 12 angry rich white women and its over for him. You know it, I know it. Dude martyrd himself from the beginning and I bet he knew it

[–] Ledericas@lemm.ee 4 points 10 hours ago

they will more than likely choose 12 retirees, and people that dont read the news that much plus any pushovers. thats how they choose these are the most easily manipulated juror types out there. ive been in different forums about juror duties, its almost always these people.

on reddit people speculated they will probably choose one where thier own insurance hasnt screwed them over, so it creates a bias for the prosecution.

[–] Robust_Mirror@aussie.zone 2 points 13 hours ago

Having one person isn't going to help much, even if they don't get replaced, it'll be a hung jury at best, unless they're the most persuasive, charismatic person on earth.

And you generally don't want a hung jury. It's just delaying, and now the other side knows your entire defence strategy and can prepare on better countering it. You having information on their strategy isn't as valuable.

[–] InverseParallax@lemmy.world 13 points 18 hours ago* (last edited 18 hours ago) (2 children)

In federal Court the judge has a lot more control in the composition of the jury., they even lead voir dire.

They can pick a jury of all ceos if they want.

[–] raltoid@lemmy.world 12 points 17 hours ago* (last edited 17 hours ago) (1 children)

That would be a bold choice, and I don't think it would work out well overall. In terms of the public response. And imagine the security, it would be locked down harder than any place in the world.

Although in all seriousness, in a normal setting they might be challenged if they chose an all-CEO jury. You can't fill a jury with the potential target victims of the crime that is being accused. It would not be seen as fair by any stretch of the imagination.

If someone was a accused of targeting very tall men with pink hair, you couldn't fill the jury with people matching that description. Any sane person in the legal business would call them crazy.

[–] Ledericas@lemm.ee 1 points 10 hours ago (1 children)

that would show extreme bias by the courts, its like an all white female jury against a black defendant.

[–] Psythik@lemm.ee 3 points 17 hours ago

Because of this fact a lot of courts will just automatically enter a not guilty plea during your first appearance now.