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What did these people smoke?! Seriously! Especially in light of what's been happening in the US. Like there's a scandal for every day since that idiot stepped into power; how can the nazis get even more popular? Or what kind of poll was that? One made by Russia?
Rhetorical question, it's one of those things in life I'll never understand.
I guess this questions also reflect back to the politicians: What the fuck do they think, trying to maintain their status quo? Do they not see that complacency ruined the DNC over there? Do they really think they can survive by maintaining a fascade while patting themselves in the back?
They aren't even maintaining the status quo. The coming German government is planning on doing a lot of what the AfD wants, notably halting practically all immigration and cutting down what's left of social welfare. The only remaining question is, why should people vote for the watered-down copy when they can vote for the original instead? They've been trying to copy the rhetoric and policies for years, but it hasn't been working (in terms of not making the AfD even bigger) and there's no reason to believe that it's going to start working now.
The same strategy was used in Sweden. Say they are right in their worldview, adopt very similar policies. All the rightwing parties (christians, liberals, conservatives) except one now collaborate with them and defend them.
Russia doesn't need to manipulate the polls, they already manipulated the voters ...
A society that does not accept the blame for the actions of its own people has no hope of changing the course in a positive direction.
A society that does not accept the blame of not being able to curb the pressure of foreign propaganda also has no hope.
I just wrote a comment to a person that said we should kick out fascists. Copy-pasting it here:
I would like to add that we should also kick out capitalism and representative democracy out of the way because fascism is a byproduct of both of them.
Capitalism, when in crises uses fascists to restore its status quo and this is how they get elected in parliaments. We can now tell with certainty, that all the worldwide measures/reforms that took place after WW2 were not effective. If they had been, fascists would not be on the rise everywhere.
There are plenty of alternative systems of organising societies for the benefit of the people, they are just not promoted by the media, this is why we don't hear about them as solution. I often use the example of kings to illustrate my point. During their era, everybody thought that this system could never change, but it did. So we can do this change as well. Actually we have to.
You seem well read and would probably agree that capitalism will climb or remove any barrier. The post war years that gave the boomers the biggest part of wealth creation in history was the result of policy that has since been dismantled bit by bit until we are once again back at the conditions for war, Fascism and social division.
I don't think capitalism has anything to do with this, especially in Germany.
It's pure lack of education and common sense.
I think it's capitalism in crisis specifically, because during crisis common people may turn to leftist ideas, so in order to prevent that, capitalists promote nationalim and fascism as better alternatives to leftist ones. Of course, I could not pretend to be able to resume all parameters in one sentence.
Apart from that, and if I got you right, I am surprised you mention that for Germany it's the lack of education. I was under the impression that since WW2 there was a lot of effort through education to avoid specifically the rise of fascism again. Did I get this wrong?
Yes and no, there's a lot of education not to mass murder Jews again, but nobody said anything about Muslims
Fascism begins the moment a ruling class, fearing the people may use their political democracy to gain economic democracy, begins to destroy political democracy in order to retain its power of exploitation and special privilege.
https://en.m.wikiquote.org/wiki/Tommy_Douglas
Capitalism most certainly has everything to do with this.
Capitalism robs the workers of most of their value and siphons it up to the owners. We then end up with, those who have far far more than they need, and those with not enough.
The internet allows us to communicate and see these injustices easier than ever before and the Arab Spring brought home to those in power just how powerful the internet can be. It is now aggressively being used against us to promote ultra capitalism and fascism in an attempt to prevent communism/socialism proliferating. And frustratingly, so far, it appears to be working.
The fact that capitalism cannot be blindly blamed for everything is shown by the example of Switzerland, which I would say is THE example of capitalism. Have you ever heard of a war in Switzerland in the last 150 years or that Switzerland is in crisis?
I also do not understand why helmet91 is being downvoted, as the user neither attacked someone directly nor said something generally offensive. However, downvoting helmet91 just shows how heated people are, losing common sense, and suggests that he or she is probably right.
Nobody should care for election polls 4 years before the next election.
there are other elections besides the federal ones
https://www.wahlrecht.de/termine.htm
Politicians should always care about the political opinions of the population and not only 6 months before elections
In my opinion, the trend is pretty damn worrying. The trend has been going on for a long time.
I understand what you mean, the actions done in the last week before an election is what drives the majority of dumb people, but inevitably you gotta plant the seed quite early on, and keep feeding the facts or misinformation (depending on which party is doing it). Sadly desinfornation campaigns have been going on on full blast, but haven't seen any effective counter actions from Volt, for example, or other parties.
Factual information, education should go on continuously on every possible channel to reach everyone. Yes, even 4 years before the election.
Factual information, education should go on continuously on every possible channel to reach everyone. Yes, even 4 years before the election.
This is not what I said. I am speaking about election polls.
The media is not innocent in the rise of the AfD. Reporting about how strong the AfD is getting is the strategy we use for years now and it just makes the party stronger.
Regarding Volt: I recommend to listen to this interview with the German top candidate of VOLT, I'll promise you won't ever think again of wasting your vote for this party
Me trying so hard becoming volt member but them not answering my email: angy
I know what you said. I can read.
And I explained my view, why I disagree with it.
Regarding Volt: please, don't promise things if you cannot keep your promise.
Just to add a bit of an explanation: all votes going to other parties than the nazis are not wasted. In fact, the more parties receive votes, the better. Best would be an equal share. Diversity is what moves us forward.
No need to get snappish.
You never addressed my points but are discussing about something else.
Right? I donβt like the guy but heβs about to become chancellor for the next 4 years and there is nothing the AfD can do about it. People are shocked to learn this blackrock board member is a selfish liar, (yeah I know, what a surpriseβ¦) but he won and doesnβt have to care about polls all that much right now.
Its just after the election. Poles dont mean anything right now
Poles dont mean anything right now
That's racist!
Well played.
Take my upvote
As an American, you are giving me flashbacks.
The AfD came second in the election, the best performance by a far-right party since World War Two.
I'm sure its fine.
On the other hand, Linke is at 11.
Bloody hell. Should Poland start fortifying western border as well?
Although i understand it is very worrying, i want to emphasize that a poll Like this doesnt make sense right at this Moment. The last government split up beginning of November. The New one just finished their coalition plans, now their party members have to agree to the plan and from may on we will have a government again. So for six month wie had no real government - in these times. Of course people feel super insecure. Since building a coalotion is always about compromisses the conservative Party gets a lot of hate for making huge compromisses and not follow their agenda. If they wouldn't they wouldn't find a partner. But people of course say " its not what they promised to do". So conservative people are upset and might just say they vote afd to shock their party. Stupid yes, but would they really do it? polls in this Situation will always meet people that are less confident and more insecure and people in this state tend more to defiance and thus to extremes, especially when the world goes absolutely crazy and we have no government to react. Its not very surprising. Let's wait a few month into the new government doing things and then see the polls. I am not optimistic that afd will go down a lot. But at the moment so shortly after the elections you cannot make good polls.
Since building a coalotion is always about compromisses the conservative Party gets a lot of hate for making huge compromisses and not follow their agenda.
That's a narrative straight out of the right wing of the right wing of the CDU. If you actually cross-check the stances of CDU voters and people like Merz you'd quickly find that voters don't really have an issue with rape in marriage being a thing you can go to prison for. And that people like GΓΌnther draw in far more votes than people like Merz. And more than, for that matter, SΓΆder.
I cannot agree with this. I mean, a sane person would never pick the nazis, even if the poll has no consequences.
I'm sure there's something else going on.
The fundamental problem is that people will vote for fascism when they feel insecure. Losing a lot of hope for Germany at this point, it's a shame.
I can only hope that the new coalition tries to improve people's lives and thus removes reasons for the AfD to exist. Otherwise the next elections are going to be a disaster.
Not holding my breath.
Yeah, conservatives don't understand how to move forwards and just like maintaining a status quo. Unfortunately, they have been in power so long that they control enough of the media outlets to influence the population to think that being progressive is a bad thing for the people. And they fuck the education system in such a way that people are easy to manipulate. What they didn't factor in, just like encryption backdoors, is that other entities might be successful at manipulating people.
They did this in so many countries in Europe (and probably abroad), that the US started flexing their conservative muscles together with Russia and this is what we get.
That's never gonna happen, especially in Germany where the historically largest parties (both socdems and conservatives) can be essentially boiled down to "nothing ever happens". Hell, I even doubt that Die Linke would be able to do much if they were somehow magically the majority in the government.
They are slashing social welfare, and the poorest are generally quite eager to vote for the nazis for some reason (certainly not their policies, they hate poor people just as much as the current government parties).