this post was submitted on 16 May 2025
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Regarding Mid-East-related Comments on !europe (feddit.org)
submitted 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) by federalreverse@feddit.org to c/europe@feddit.org
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Hi.

In the past few days, discontent regarding mod decisions in this community has been brewing, particularly when it comes to comments on Palestine, Israel, and Israeli politics and actions. There are also misunderstandings regarding mod intention and German law. We hope to clear that up with this post.

While the servers of feddit.org are in Austria, most of the mods of this community as well as admins of this server live in Germany. Speaking of, our server admins have also posted a write-up on the same topic.

And with that, let's go:

In Germany, antisemitism is specifically sanctioned in German criminal law, both for speech and as a motivation for other criminal behavior. In addition, Germany seeks to protect the Jewish state of Israel (the so-called "Reason of State" introduced in 2008) and thus verges toward protecting Zionism as well. Certain criticism of Israel/Israelis is also categorized as "Israel-related antisemitism".

Since criminal law is involved, enforcement can mean things like police raids and device confiscations. After such police action, it does not really matter if it was appropriate or if cases are dropped or never charged: The damage is done. All told, it's not that fun.

There is also no point in engaging in discussions about the veracity of statements that could get us into legal trouble. In addition, we believe that you can express most opinions without breaking rules.

If your comment contains the following, it will be removed from this community:

  • Calling for the dissolution of Israel, or calling for a one-state solution without specifying equal rights for all people; Jewish in particular.
  • Calling for a destruction, annihilation, an end of all Zionism or the like.
  • Equating Israeli actions and (historical) Nazism.
  • The slogan "from the river..."
  • Endorsement of or justifications for Hamas or Hezbollah, or slogans or graphics positively referring to these organizations. These are considered terrorist organizations in Germany.
  • ... and obviously: Any of the common antisemitic tropes or calls to violence against Jews or Israelis

Comments will not be removed for the following:

  • Denouncing genocide.
  • Denouncing Israeli war crimes.
  • Criticizing Zionism as an ideology or political movement.
  • Referring to the current Israeli government as "criminal," "expansionist," or "far-right".

If your comment is removed nonetheless, these are not the reason. I'd also like to stress that this community was never a free-speech-absolutist zone: It is a (usually lightly) moderated community. There may also be times when bans go too far. In such cases, please DM the @EuroMod@feddit.org account (which all mods have access to).

To help you understand why, I'll leave an assortment of sources here (translations via DeepL).

  • A news report:

    Berlin in mid-May [2024] around 6 o'clock in the morning. A loud, continuous "banging" against the apartment door wakes student Alina T. from her sleep. [...] When her husband opens the door, several LKA officers, two employees of the district office and the SEK "storm" past him into the apartment. Puzzled, he looks at the search warrant. [...] The background to this was a Facebook entry in the student's profile: "From the river [...]

  • A legal treatise:

    In November 2023, the Federal Ministry of the Interior and for Home Affairs also issued a prohibition order against Hamas.[60] According to the order, "the slogan 'From the River to the Sea' (in German or other languages)" is a distinguishing mark of Hamas[61]. [...] the current legal situation [regarding "Denial of Israel's right to exist"] is - contrary to what the statements of the Federal Ministry of Justice suggest[63] - anything but clear. Whether incitements to eliminate the State of Israel are prosecuted depends on the respective legal opinion and the prosecution will of the respective public prosecutor's office.

  • Press release from the previous government:

    In this context, Section 111 StGB, which covers public incitement to commit crimes, may also be relevant. Incitement to extinguish Israel's existence by force may be punishable under this provision. The same applies to calls to publicly display the Hamas flag. If Hamas attacks are publicly cheered and celebrated, this may also be punishable. This means that people who cheer on Hamas's actions or publicly express their sympathy with the attacks may constitute the criminal offence of "approval of criminal acts" under Section 140 of the German Criminal Code (StGB).

  • Another news report

    In connection with the controversial Palestine Congress in Berlin, the German authorities have also imposed an entry ban on former Greek finance minister Yanis Varoufakis. "In order to prevent antisemitic and anti-Israel propaganda at the event", several entry bans have been issued, the news agency AFP learned from security sources on Sunday. One of these concerned Varoufakis. (Notably, Varoufakis would have spoken about one-state solutions ...)

  • Overview Germany in 2024 by Amnesty International

  • Overview Germany in 2024 by Human Rights Watch

federal reverse (on behalf of the mods of !europe)

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[โ€“] rumschlumpel@feddit.org 3 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

Doesn't look like the majority of the population is interested in that, so it's either going to take a revolution led by a minority (definitely going to be violent) or intervention by a foreign occupying force (still probably going to be violent). TBH I don't really see a likely solution to this that's not going to be violent, heavy international pressure could work but the USA are not going to change their policy anytime soon, which also prevents a foreign occupying force; wouldn't even surprise me if they invaded if there was a revolution.

[โ€“] rocket_dragon@lemmy.dbzer0.com 8 points 21 hours ago (1 children)

If you follow that line of reasoning:

Because we can't stop Israel without violence, any call to stop Israel is a call for violence against Israel.

And violence against Israel is banned.

So stopping Israel is banned.

So the rules enforce allowing Israel to continue a genocide.

The rules are pro-genocide.

[โ€“] poVoq@slrpnk.net -2 points 8 hours ago* (last edited 8 hours ago) (3 children)

By the same contrived logic you are pro-genocide as calling for the destruction of the Israeli state in an online forum also doesn't stop the genocide.

And anyways, by your logic if the only response to one genocide is another genocide, then yes that is also pro-genocide.

See how pointless such arguments are?

[โ€“] timconspicuous@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 hour ago (1 children)

I find all of your comments here deeply shameful, especially since you are representing slrpnk.net, from your own manifesto:

The โ€œpunkโ€ in Solarpunk is about rebellion, counterculture, post-capitalism, decolonialism and enthusiasm.

Yet you are using your voice here to defend state-mandated infringement of free speech, of decolonialist speech at the behest of the zionist project. I honestly think you should consider if you can still credibly administer slrpnk or alternatively if it makes sense for you to moderate a comm that is seemingly so misaligned with your professed values.

[โ€“] poVoq@slrpnk.net 1 points 27 minutes ago

You can try to troll me with such entirely false accusations, but I can sleep well with my stance to be against all forms of genocide and zero tolerance on hate-speech. If you choose to be a campist that's on you ๐Ÿคท

[โ€“] rocket_dragon@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 3 hours ago

By the same contrived logic

No, those are absurd statements with no logic.

See how pointless such arguments are?

Yours are, mine isn't.

You could try actually addressing what I say instead of making absurd statements and then acting like you making absurd statements is proof that my statement is absurd.

[โ€“] anarchiddy@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 4 hours ago (1 children)

by your logic if the only response to one genocide is another genocide, then yes that is also pro-genocide

Yea, see this is the antisemitic version of zionism. Advocating for the liberation of Palestine isn't the same as advocating for a genocide or expulsion of Jews in Israel. It would be like saying WWII was ultimately a genocide of germans, since they were violently resisted in their conquest of Europe.

Yes, the resistance against genocide will almost certainly involve violence - that doesn't mean that advocating for resistance isn't justified, or even that advocating for violent resistance isn't justified. WWII would have been really short if we had rhetorically 'opposed' the holocaust, but banned any speech that even implied violence against Germans (including violent liberation to stop an active genocide).

[โ€“] poVoq@slrpnk.net 1 points 2 hours ago

As you say youself, there is a difference between arguing for equal rights of Palestinians and the expulsion of Jews from the territory that makes up modern day Israel.

The German government has decided that certain slogans commonly used by Arab antisemites are (criminally liable) dogwhistles for calling for a genocide on Jews in Israel. I wish they would apply more nuance but I can see where they are coming from.