this post was submitted on 15 Jun 2025
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No Stupid Questions

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Edit for context:

My view is transracial isn’t valid and this person is trying to dogwhistle. I’ve already blocked this person, and now they’re going after my friend saying my friend is transphobic because they disagreed with them about transracial being a thing (they're purposefully leaving the context out so my friend looks transphobic when what my friend really said was transgender is valid but transracial isn't)

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[–] Jobe@feddit.org 24 points 18 hours ago* (last edited 18 hours ago) (2 children)

They don't appear to understand the difference between cultural and gender identity. I'd try this:
"If a white person of european descent were raised from birth by a Sentinel Island tribe, would they be culturally european?"
The answer is obviously no, illustrating that the cultural identity of a person depends on the culture the person was raised in. I don't know how gender identity works, but clearly how someone is raised has little to do with it.
Edit: Disclaimer that I have absolutely no idea what I am talking about.

[–] Saleh@feddit.org 15 points 17 hours ago (1 children)

Problem is that "race" isn't just cultural. How you will be treated definitely depends on how other people perceive your "race" and subsequently it will shape your life reality.

That person you gave as an example? In the US, Canada or most European countries he will be treated better than an actual Citizen born and raised in the respective country who is perceived as "black" or "brown".

[–] SaltSong@startrek.website 2 points 17 hours ago (2 children)

Problem is that “race” isn’t just cultural. How you will be treated definitely depends on how other people perceive your “race” and subsequently it will shape your life reality

But surely how you will be treated definitely depends on how other people perceive your “gender” and subsequently it will shape your life reality?

Everything you described up there sounds exactly like "cultural."

[–] seralth@lemmy.world 1 points 1 hour ago* (last edited 1 hour ago)

Social constructed concepts are applied by others to you. Those concepts and frameworks are build up by the community over time. So where your born matters a lot as what framework your raised in is going to be the one you adopt naturally and use to also see yourself though.

That's fundamentally the problem. Race and gender both, it doesn't matter what you choose or think of for yourself. You don't get to decide what others see you as. And since it's communal you as a single person can't change it for everyone. It takes many people working together over long periods of time to change.

Which is why it's such problem, humans are fundamentally a social animal. We WANT to fit in, so when our self perception doesn't align with what others see us as we become distressed.

So with in the social framework others see us as, we try to realign ourselves to be perceived as what we want. This removes the misalignment of self perception with social perception.

Fundamentally this is one of the biggest aspects of transgender body dysphoria. That social misalignment vs transsexual body dysphoria and it's physical misalignment.

Tho transsexual body dysphoria can also play a role here or none at all.

As transsexual body dysphoria tends to be rather detached entirely from the social construct. People are able to have one or the other and both. Transsexual body dysphoria is very self driven and almost if not entirely based on ones own perception of their own body.

Remember gender is made up and fluid based on the culture. Sex is biological and rooted in the physical.

[–] Saleh@feddit.org 2 points 17 hours ago (1 children)

That makes gender more like "ethnicity"/"race" rather than "culture" don't you think?

[–] SaltSong@startrek.website 0 points 16 hours ago (1 children)

I'm advised that there is no scientific or genetic basis for race. I'm a little unclear on how "ethnicity" is different from "race."

All of them seem to be social constructs.

[–] amino@lemmy.blahaj.zone 4 points 13 hours ago* (last edited 13 hours ago)

social construct isn't a synonym for "doesn't exist". just because scientific racism is illogical it doesn't mean that white people don't behave as if we're superior to others, whether consciously or not. you can't say racism is ethnic oppression because even comparing between white Latino and Black Latino there's a statistical difference in police brutality based on anti-Blackness

[–] amino@lemmy.blahaj.zone 6 points 18 hours ago* (last edited 18 hours ago) (1 children)

culture and ethnicity have nothing to do with race. race is based on perceived phenotype

[–] FerretyFever0@fedia.io 2 points 17 hours ago (1 children)

I'd say that a lot of race is based upon shared experiences with other members of the group, and being seen as part of the group. Many people from the Middle East and North Africa see themselves as white. A lot of white Americans and Europeans disagree. I would say that being perceived as a member of an in group is more important than actual color. For example, some lighter skinned African-Americans were able to be perceived as white, thus being treated significantly better. Were they black? Of course they were. They made a conscious decision to pick which experiences and culture they wanted. But they definitely had experiences where they didn't pass, and had experiences according to their given race.

[–] amino@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 points 16 hours ago* (last edited 16 hours ago) (1 children)

what you're talking about is proximity to whiteness. AFAIK passing was not a choice which makes Dolezal's actions even more violent. lighter Black people benefit from colorism but they're still at risk of lynching because of their race. white people doing blackface is a way to mock that powerlessness felt by victims of white supremacy and make money from clout.

as for non-white SWANA people assimilating into whiteness, that's a way to harness the colonial power structure to their own benefit by distancing themselves from Black people. this is all a trauma response and survival mechanism from centuries of European genocide like colored South Africans with the same phenotype as indigenous Africans claiming they're not Black.

[–] FerretyFever0@fedia.io 1 points 13 hours ago

If one was assumed to be white, then they could either make the choice to correct them, or not. Dolezal is fucking ridiculous, and definitely just trying to sow discord and violence, especially towards transgender people.