Lab-Grown Salmon Hits the Menu at an Oregon Restaurant as the FDA Greenlights the Cell-Cultured Product : vegan

[–] wolfyvegan@slrpnk.net 1 points 8 hours ago* (last edited 7 hours ago) (3 children)

To make their product, the food company’s scientists collect living cells from Pacific salmon

And how can the salmon give free, prior, informed consent for this? This is still exploitation. This is not vegan.

EDIT: This could be done ethically if the company collected still-living cells from the bodies of recently deceased salmon in spawning season or if they collected genetic material from male gametes that did not end up fertilising an egg, but I've not found anything to suggest that this company does it this way.

[–] phoenixz@lemmy.ca 3 points 4 hours ago (1 children)

Oh come on, cut the nonsense

No animal can give consent. Hell, no human could give consent if they didn't speak the same language as you.

Given the option to be killed or getting a scratch to take a sample of cells, you don't think any animal would chose the latter? That is, of course, if animals could understand that concept even.

Look, there is doing the right thing and there is just pretending to do so. This, of applicable to all animals, would be a huge leap forward. Factory farming without the abuse of sentient beings is enormous for animal rights and treatment. We could stop pulling the seas empty, no more tortuous slaughter houses...

But here you are "but the animals didn't consent to a needle prick, it's bad!"

[–] wolfyvegan@slrpnk.net 1 points 4 hours ago

Found the consequentialist.

[–] fubarx@lemmy.world 2 points 4 hours ago (1 children)

Consent-wise, would a side-to-side tail-waggle count as a Yes or a No?

[–] wolfyvegan@slrpnk.net 0 points 4 hours ago* (last edited 4 hours ago)

I can't tell if this is a serious question, but I don't know enough about salmon to answer it, or even whether there would be a conclusive answer.

EDIT: And that was kind of the point. I don't know whether it would even be possible for a salmon to consent to this sort of thing.

[–] Beastimus@slrpnk.net 3 points 7 hours ago (3 children)

Are you serious about this? If so that standard seems pretty insane to me.

Like, we essentially can't do anything with animals with that...

[–] Strawberry@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 points 41 minutes ago

Did you look at what community you're commenting on? Why are you so determined to use other animals?

[–] stabby_cicada@slrpnk.net 3 points 5 hours ago* (last edited 5 hours ago)

Like, we essentially can't do anything with animals with that...

Yes. That's the point. Animals are sapient beings with rights, not objects to "do things with".

That being said, I recognize how far out of the Overton Window that attitude is.

Positive thought: if cultured meat goes mainstream, I expect there will be demand for "ethically sourced" cell lines - or some ad campaign will use it as a selling point - and shift the idea of not exploiting animals just a tiny bit closer to the mainstream :)

[–] wolfyvegan@slrpnk.net 2 points 7 hours ago

It's the same standard that I use for young children. If doing the thing is not clearly in their best interest, I don't touch them without their consent.

So yes, just leave other animals alone. Pretty simple.

[–] Anomalocaris@lemm.ee 16 points 17 hours ago (3 children)

i hope the tech will one day make slaughtering animals for meat a social taboo

like remembering the times before we had toilet paper...

However, the tech alone isn't even close to what's needed, remove mead subsidies. make it so it's a one every few days meal (like it used to be), not the core part of every meal.

also increase animal welfare regulation, so animals suffer less.

that will pivot farmers from meat production, and animal feed production to produce. we will need much less land to cultivate, so rewild them. IE, just abandon them and let nature reclaim it.

[–] AngryCommieKender@lemmy.world 1 points 3 hours ago* (last edited 3 hours ago)

remove mead subsidies.

We have mead subsides? Do we have a strategic mead stockpile? Can I get some fermented honey?

/j

I'm making mead in Vintage Story.... I should get a small bottle to remind myself why I don't drink the stuff.

[–] stabby_cicada@slrpnk.net 2 points 5 hours ago

that will pivot farmers from meat production, and animal feed production to produce. we will need much less land to cultivate, so rewild them. IE, just abandon them and let nature reclaim it.

I would argue, for the US, we should not rewild, but rematriate. Return the land to the tribes we stole it from and let them decide what to do next.

After all, Native Americans were the keystone species in every biome in North America for tens of thousands of years. Restoring the pre-Colombian ecology requires humans to occupy and manage the land. The myth of human-free American wilderness is settler colonial bullshit.

[–] dharmacurious@slrpnk.net -1 points 16 hours ago (2 children)

I'm on board with this, but, and I'm totally willing to be corrected if I'm wrong, abandoning our farm animals en mass seems like a bad idea. Especially pigs. Cows might fill the niche left by bison or aurochs, chickens are fucking suicidal and find unique ways to die whenever possible, but farm pigs turn into giant ass boar that aren't native and can genuinely harm people, property, pets and just generally wreak havoc. I'm not sure what a good alternative is, to be honest, since their current conditions are utterly cruel, but just turning them loose by the millions seems like something we'll regret a lot a decade later

[–] AlmightyDoorman@kbin.earth 4 points 10 hours ago (1 children)

A quick and dirty internet search says that a typical farm pig lives around 7 months. So you could ban every meat pig product in a year, stop breeding new pigs and just murder the old ones for meat and you would have no problem at all. So a grace period of less than a year is needed and you wouldn't have this problem. (I also seriously doubt that most farm pigs would be able to survive in the wild, but for that i am not knowledgeable enough. But e.g. modern chickens have a huge calcium deficiency which makes them not very suited for wildlife, there was an study that the average chicken at any given time has three broken bones.)

Or to put it in another way, we have to replace all farm pigs almost twice yearly anyway, so let's just stop replacing them.

[–] dharmacurious@slrpnk.net 1 points 4 hours ago

That makes a lot of sense. My knowledge on feral farm pigs is anecdotal at best, but from what I've been told and understand (at work now, so not enough time to research it properly) hogs that get released or escape breed with wild pigs and create dangerous pigstrosities, but that may well be farmer lore/old wives tales for all I know

[–] Anomalocaris@lemm.ee 6 points 16 hours ago

sorry, but definition not just releasing farm animals into the wild.

let's just have a gradual transition where frames just raise less animals as demand decreases.

good, releasing all the farm animals into the wild might do more damage than what those farms are doing.

I meant just letting abandoned farms turn into wild forests, now opening the gates.

[–] sharkfucker420@lemmy.ml 6 points 14 hours ago* (last edited 14 hours ago)

Holy hell I am like a 30 minute tram ride away from this. Will definitely give it a shot when I can. I am not used to things being this close lmao

[–] elbucho@lemmy.world 7 points 17 hours ago

Awesome! I'm currently pursuing a biochemistry degree with the goal of working in the cultivated meat industry, so this is super exciting to me! It seems the process is still too clunky for effective mass production, unfortunately. But hey - maybe that's a problem I'll be able to help solve!

Vegan